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Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 1:34 pm
by mystic
Mike G wrote:I didn't understand all the talk on TV about how the Heat need to rebuild.
Well, the Heat only have 1 player fixed under contract for next season, Norris Cole. James, Bosh and Wade have ETOs, Haslem and Anderson have POs. Then they have Hamilton on an unguaranteed min contract. They most likely need to rebuild anyway, no matter whether James, Bosh and Wade are using their ETO or not.

And why didn't they use other players? Well, those players weren't particular good. Replacing not so good players with even worse players will not help winning more games. ;)

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:00 pm
by Mike G
Wade's 32, has had multiple knee injuries/surgeries in his career, only played 54 regular season games this season and his +/- performance this season fell off a cliff
Wade was ok vs Cha, better vs Brk, and really good vs Ind. This after a season in which he set some sort of record for shooting accuracy for a guard. Did he suddenly turn 32 last week and fall off a cliff?

Updating from another thread:

Code: Select all

      LeBron James                           
opp   mpg   Eff%   Sco   Reb   Ast    PF   Stl   TO   Blk   e480  eWins
Cha   39   .652   37.3   8.4   7.1   1.6   2.1   2.8   .2   3.50  1.14
Brk   40   .664   34.2   7.1   4.2   2.2   1.1   2.1   .5   2.68  1.13
Ind   36   .626   28.9   8.1   7.6   2.9   2.0   3.7   .9   2.72  1.22
SAS   38   .668   31.8   9.6   3.7   1.9   1.9   4.1   .4   2.22   .88
                                 
      Dwyane Wade                           
Cha   33   .538   22.5   4.0   5.9   3.3   1.4   2.8   .3   1.55   .43
Brk   35   .548   21.1   4.9   6.4   2.9   1.5   2.4   .6   1.65   .60
Ind   36   .607   24.3   5.6   6.7   2.6   1.7   3.0   .2   1.98   .88
SAS   34   .494   14.9   5.2   2.8   3.0   1.7   4.3   .0    .48   .17
                                 
      Chris Bosh                           
opp   mpg   Eff%   Sco   Reb   Ast    PF   Stl   TO   Blk   e480  eWins
Cha   32   .624   18.1   6.7   2.4   3.1    .9    .9  1.2   1.30   .35
Brk   36   .598   14.7   7.3    .9   1.4    .8    .6  2.0   1.09   .41
Ind   33   .545   17.8   8.5   1.8   4.0   1.1    .8   .9   1.38   .56
SAS   36   .619   14.8   6.6   1.0   2.4    .8    .9   .2    .72   .27
                                 
      Mario Chalmers                           
Cha   26   .537   13.8   4.0   7.1   1.8    .7    .8   .4   1.18   .25
Brk   30   .529    9.5   3.7   8.1   3.5   2.0   2.1   .2    .88   .27
Ind   28   .557    8.3   4.7   6.6   2.9    .9   2.4   .7    .56   .19
SAS   23   .431    5.7   2.8   4.5   5.1   1.6   3.5   .3   -.10  -.02
                                 
      Chris Andersen                           
opp   mpg   Eff%   Sco   Reb   Ast    PF   Stl   TO   Blk   e480  eWins
Cha   20   .654   15.5  10.4   1.1   2.4    .4    .4  2.1   1.41   .24
Brk   13   .615    9.1  14.8    .0   3.1    .5   1.1  3.7   1.30   .17
Ind   14   .725   15.3  17.3   1.7   3.4    .4   1.4  1.3   1.86   .32
SAS   18   .382    3.5  13.4    .0   5.3    .8   1.3  1.1    .35   .07
                                 
      Ray Allen                           
Cha   20   .342    4.2   5.0   3.5   2.8    .8   2.7   .0   -.33  -.06
Brk   27   .657   19.7   7.6   3.2   2.6    .5   1.1   .3   1.45   .40
Ind   26   .598   13.4   4.7   2.4   2.2    .4   1.2   .4    .61   .20
SAS   31   .551   11.0   4.4   2.1   3.2   1.8   2.0   .2    .36   .12
                                 
      Norris Cole                           
opp   mpg   Eff%   Sco   Reb   Ast    PF   Stl   TO   Blk   e480  eWins
Cha   28   .673   12.2   1.4   4.2   2.1    .6   1.3   .3    .37   .09
Brk   16   .467    5.4   3.2   2.4   3.4    .4   1.8   .0   -.36  -.06
Ind   22   .580    8.5   2.0   4.8   2.9    .8   1.5   .0    .17   .05
SAS   17   .381    4.8   3.1   3.7   3.2    .8   2.7   .0   -.26  -.04
                                 
      Rashard Lewis                           
Cha    8   .364    5.7  11.6   1.3   6.6    .9   1.0  1.9    .51   .03
Brk   14   .433    4.8   5.8    .7   2.3   1.4    .5   .0   -.08  -.01
Ind   17   .554   10.4   3.7    .5   2.6   1.1    .8   .7    .19   .04
SAS   23   .652   15.0   3.3    .6   3.2    .0    .4   .7    .46   .11
                                 
      Shane Battier                           
opp   mpg   Eff%   Sco   Reb   Ast    PF   Stl   TO   Blk   e480  eWins
Brk   19   .577    5.9   2.5   1.7   2.4   1.2    .8   .4   -.15  -.03
Ind   12   .815   12.8   2.4    .6   5.7    .5   1.5   .0   -.04  -.01
SAS    7   .000     .0   1.3   1.0   5.0   1.0   1.1   .0   -.84  -.06
There wasn't any bright spot in the Finals, except maybe Rashard Lewis, dimly.
And why didn't they use other players? Well, those players weren't particular good. Replacing not so good players with even worse players will not help winning more games.
If you don't play someone, you don't know if they're very good or bad. And then when you finally do play them, there's a good chance they'll be less effective than if they had been in the rotation all along.

When the Spurs were struggling against OKC, Pop yanked the starters, and the subs got them back in the game. Of course, that works better when your subs are better.
But the Heat were just fine in their first 3 series. They came into the Finals with a 12-3 record. Not against the greatest competition; but that's 80% wins in the playoffs.

The combination of the Spurs shooting the lights out and several Heats going into prolonged slumps -- Wade, Chalmers, Cole, Birdman, Ray Allen -- that's the opposite of the 2 years when the Heat won the title. Guys came out of nowhere and torched the opponent -- Battier and Miller, notably. This year the Spurs had those guys.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:23 pm
by J.E.
Mike G wrote:
Wade's 32, has had multiple knee injuries/surgeries in his career, only played 54 regular season games this season and his +/- performance this season fell off a cliff
Wade was ok vs Cha, better vs Brk, and really good vs Ind. This after a season in which he set some sort of record for shooting accuracy for a guard. Did he suddenly turn 32 last week and fall off a cliff?
I'm talking about his +/-. Wade has had a NET rating usually around +10, for almost his entire career. This year it's -2. I'm assuming that glimpses of this were noticable a few weeks into the regular season.

This season, per NBAWOWY.com, the Heat were:
- With LeBron, no Wade: +9
- With LeBron, Wade: +5
- With Wade, no LeBron: -3

Not awful, but certainly not up to his own standards. The knee injuries make me think he won't age as well as e.g. Tim Duncan

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 10:20 pm
by Mike G
Knee injuries or whatever, he'd often get the ball, pass on an open shot, put the ball on the floor, not get another good look ...
This seemed somewhat contagious.
In the 2013 Finals, Manu Ginobili was pretty terrible by his standards. Of course, he was 35 years old, had missed 54 games in 2 years, a long history of injury ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdHsowOBYDs

During the season, the Spurs were about 4 ppg better (SRS) than the Heat.
Coming into the Finals, the playoff difference (15-18 games) was up to almost 5 ppg.
Both teams were outperforming their expectations.

Code: Select all

2014  season - playoffs - - - - - - - - - 
Team    SRS    MOV   oppSRS   SRS     diff
SAS    8.00    8.0    4.59   12.59    4.59
LAC    7.27    2.0    5.85    7.85     .58
Mia    4.15    7.0     .69    7.69    3.54
Losing by 14 ppg in the Finals, the Heat as a team were about 9 ppg worse than they'd been previously. Nobody got hurt, everybody played worse.

So it was a great 5 games by the Spurs and/or 5 bad games by the Heat -- this after 97 mostly good games. No reason to panic.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:00 pm
by mystic
Mike G wrote:If you don't play someone, you don't know if they're very good or bad. And then when you finally do play them, there's a good chance they'll be less effective than if they had been in the rotation all along.
But they have played already; the players you mentioned aren't some nobodies and never played significant minutes before. But when we look at Haslem or Beasley for example, they haven't been playing well at all recently; in fact, for my next season prediction I have them with about -3.1 each, which would be below the replacement level. Jones and Battier are better, but Battier showed a pretty sharp decline ever since February (for whatever reason) and Jones showed to be best used with James running at PF, which caused other defensive issues for the Heat.
Mike G wrote: When the Spurs were struggling against OKC, Pop yanked the starters, and the subs got them back in the game.
You mean when he replaced Splitter in the S5 with Bonner? As an adjustment to the comeback by Ibaka? That's all he did. That created different matchups, but overall it didn't make that much of a difference. I think you underrate the variance aspect here and try to find reason in more or less marginal adjustment. Overall the Spurs were substantially better in average than the Thunder; but even in that case a team may lose two games in a row; or sometimes the better team is losing a series based just on bad luck. That happens.

Nonetheless, the Heat didn't have those options anyway in the necessary quality. The players besides James, Bosh and Wade weren't as good in average, and with Wade struggling to reach his average level the Heat played substantially worse with him on the court than in previous seasons. In fact, while the Heat played elite basketball with James+Bosh+Wade on the court in the past 3 seasons, they didn't do that in this season at any point in a consistent way. That Heat team was substantially worse than the 2011 to 2013 version of them, while having to deal with a similar offensive style as they had to deal with in the 2011 finals (with some of the Nowitzki midpost actions replaced by some Duncan low post actions). And that was mainly a defensive issue, not so much an offense issue (although the Heat aggressive perimeter defense usually creates better offensive opportunities via fastbreaks). The Heat defense had big trouble to recover from help, based on the spacing created by the Spurs due to player and ball movement. When the Spurs run those high p&r/p action with Parker or Ginobili top of the key (or on the wings), the Heat overly aggressive attacked that (which works usually better), while that brought the help too far out to be back in position; which gave the Spurs the opportunities for perimeter shots (via extra pass) or opened up the middle for a drive/cut to the basket (Leonard or Green in different games). And then the Heat defense was in such bad positions underneath the basket, that the Spurs could work the offensive glass without sacrificing their transition defense much.
What the Heat could have used here would have been better help defenders from the interior and less aggressive defense against perimeter ball handlers. But only Battier could have helped here, while he obviously struggled over the past months. Neither Haslem was in a shape to be a help (he is better suited working 1on1 against bigger guys operating from the mid to high post, not really a low post defender against Duncan), nor do Jones or Beasley possess any kind of skills in that aspect, which could have been helpful.

So, in the end, the Heat didn't create the amount of turnovers usually created by their defense; their defensive rebounding was not adequate enough basically based on their defensive failures before the shot attempt by the Spurs occured, and the general lack of proper help with trouble to recover made it easier for the Spurs. I really don't see how Haslem (at his current state), Beasley or Jones could have helped here in any way. And then we have seen Battier to not be at his level from last season as well as at the level he had for the first part of this season for whatever reason.
Mike G wrote: But the Heat were just fine in their first 3 series. They came into the Finals with a 12-3 record. Not against the greatest competition; but that's 80% wins in the playoffs.
The record is meaningless, because of the competition; the toughest matchup was a struggling Pacers team, which wasn't even close to be the same team after the Granger for Turner trade as they were before. If you look at the WC playoff teams, I see the Heat having more trouble with all teams; imagine they have to deal in the first round with those Mavericks; going for the same player and ball movement plays the Spurs did; a team being able to beat the Spurs at their game on the road. The difference in terms of strength between the conferences clouded the weaknesses of the Heat this season, a team never being able to play consistently at a level they had before. Going by their playoff record against 3 teams, where 2 are looked at in the historical perspective not really playoff teams, and one not being at their best, is really misleading.
Mike G wrote: The combination of the Spurs shooting the lights out and several Heats going into prolonged slumps -- Wade, Chalmers, Cole, Birdman, Ray Allen -- that's the opposite of the 2 years when the Heat won the title. Guys came out of nowhere and torched the opponent -- Battier and Miller, notably. This year the Spurs had those guys.
Way too easy to look at that. Battier and Miller didn't come out of nowhere, they were quality backup players when healthy. Last season the Heat were lucky that they didn't lose to the Spurs with a somewhat struggling Parker due to injuries as well as a Ginobili have trouble to bring his game to the floor due to physical issues as well. And the Heat needed an incredible lucky shot by Ray Allen to surive and not lose in 6. Now the Spurs had a Parker in better shape and Ginobili was much, much better than last season. The Spurs winning was much less about "guys came out of nowhere" than about them being in better shape at this point.
Spurs were shooting "the lights out", because they got those open opportunities, and used them this time. Besides Leonard and Mills nobody made them really at an above expected rate, and when we "correct" the result for that shooting by Mills and Leonard, the Spurs would still be at +9 over those 5 games vs. the Heat. The Heat didn't lose, because the Spurs got somehow lucky with their shots, the Heat lost, because they had no answer talent-wise defensively against the Spurs offense.
So, and when you say that Allen had a "slump", I asked how much better than 41% from 3 is he expected to shoot? Lewis made 46% of his 3pt attempts, Bosh had 39% ... there wasn't much of a "slump" visible, except for Chalmers. And Wade's numbers had less to do with bad luck with his shooting, but more with his inability to get the same separation for his midrange shots as well as lacking the necessary footspeed to get to the basket in the same effective way as before. Andersen has a case here, where his minor injury really seem to have made an impact, but that explains only a small portion of the defensive struggles the Heat had. Other than that, we saw a severe difference in overall talent in favor of the Spurs, and that could have been picked up before the finals. So, yeah, I don't buy your explanation here that this was just some luck/bad luck result and the Heat could go on with the same roster and see a better result next season ...

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:56 pm
by Mike G
I don't think I said a bad 5 games was all just "bad luck", nor that any team should keep the same aging lineup and expect to do as well or better, year after year.

Parsing out the individual ups and downs of players and lineups, we don't alter the fact that through 97 games, the Heat looked like 4 to 5 ppg underdogs to the Spurs. They did 9-10 ppg worse than that in the Finals.

Did they suddenly change from one of the top teams to one of the worst teams in the league? 14 ppg is the expected MOV of the Spurs vs Orlando or Utah.
They beat Cha by 10 ppg (SRS suggests +5), Brk by 4.5 (vs 5.7), Ind by 6.5 (0.5) -- this looks like a team on a roll.
[yes, the Pacers were not that good; and the Nets were not that bad.]

The Heat and the Mavs were the league's oldest teams this year, averaging 30.6 years. Spurs were 4th at 28.9 -- yet their older players didn't fall apart noticeably. Was this predictable?

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:39 pm
by Mike G
After their 2007 title, the Spurs had a few playoff disappointments. The last 3 years, mostly overachievement:

Code: Select all

year   SRS    mov   over 
2008  5.10 
Phx   5.14    2.0   +2.0
NOH   5.46     0    +0.4  
LAL   7.34   -5.0   -2.7

2009  3.36
Dal   1.68   -6.0   -7.7

2010  5.07
Dal   2.67    0.5   -1.9
Phx   4.68   -9.2   -9.6

2011  5.86
Mem   2.55   -3.2   -6.5

2012  7.28
Uta    .92   16.0   +9.6
LAC   2.82   11.5   +7.0
Okl   6.44   -4.5   -5.3

2013  6.67
LAL   1.49   18.7  +13.5
GSW   1.32    4.2   -1.2 
Mem   4.33   11.0   +8.7
Mia   7.03     .7   +1.1

2014  8.00
Dal   2.91    2.0   -3.1
Por   4.44   13.4   +9.8
Okl   6.66   10.5   +9.2
Mia   4.15   14.0  +10.2
With superior depth of personnel, Pop can mostly dictate the terms. Opposing coaches are forced to adjust, to mimic or mirror the Spurs' moves.

The Heat this year seemed to go with resting their main guys, letting them coast thru the regular season. This worked well enough, thru the Eastern playoffs.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:47 pm
by mystic
Mike G wrote:I don't think I said a bad 5 games was all just "bad luck", nor that any team should keep the same aging lineup and expect to do as well or better, year after year.
Ok, probably a misunderstanding based on 3 things:

1. You didn't understand the talk about the Heat needing a rebuild.
2. You seemed to argue that the margin of victory by the Spurs was largely based on bad luck and lack of options used by Spoelstra.
3. You argued something along the line of "Heat were on the roll in EC playoffs".

My basic arguments here:

1. Heat need to rebuild anyway, based on lack of player's under contract as well as possible own FA being older (or even retiring) or have a severe lack of quality.
2. Spurs were better by about 6 ppg, if the whole season including all playoff games is used as basis. Spurs had some luck with shooting, but Heat also had a bad matchup situation defensively. Also, the not-so-much used alternatives you named weren't expected to give a positive impact in that matchup against the Spurs.
3. You overrate the Heat run in the EC, based on overvaluing the playing level of the opponents as well as undervaluing the amount of luck the Heat had. "The Heat were on a roll" isn't something which should be used for predictions.

Overall the Heat were not as good as in previous seasons, and nobody should expect the James+Bosh+Wade lineup giving a similar playing level as between 2011 and 2013 in the future. Given the status of the supporting cast, a rebuild is very much needed, completely independent from the decision by James, Bosh and Wade to use their ETOs.


P.S. You shouldn't judge teams based on their SRS alone; take the minute distribution in the playoffs into account and you get a better picture in terms of "overachieving". Also, don't underestimate runs in smaller samples. ;)

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 10:16 pm
by Mike G
You shouldn't judge teams based on their SRS alone; take the minute distribution in the playoffs into account and you get a better picture...
So, the Heat coach didn't use his best players or optimize their minutes? Or what?
"The Heat were on a roll" isn't something which should be used for predictions.
Also, don't underestimate runs in smaller samples.
If you're going to say the Miami competition wasn't very good, how about quantifying that? Of course, that was already done earlier in this thread.
If SRS says SA was better by 4 ppg in the season, and 5 ppg in the playoffs -- and you say it's really 6 ppg -- what then accounts for the 14 ppg differential that resulted?

The matchups were essentially the same this year and last year. The Spurs played their best ball of the year, arguably, while the Heat played their worst.
In midseason, the Spurs had a 1-4 spell. Good thing they didn't blow up the team!

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 12:30 am
by Mike G
Game by game eW/480 rates for Miami players, reconstituted from the cumulative numbers posted.

Code: Select all

G   LBJ    Bosh   Wade    Ray    Rio  Lewis   Bird   Cole
1   1.90   1.52    .67   1.48   -.63   -.24   -.19   -.13
2   3.06   1.21    .99    .63    .11    .97   -.09   -.13
3   1.49    .06   1.06    .06   -.47    .74    .77   -.36
4   2.19    .34    .08   -.04   -.25   -.27   1.34   -.54
5   2.43    .53   -.39   -.43    .92   1.63    .43   -.09

T   2.22    .72    .48    .36   -.10    .46    .35   -.26
Avg eW/480 is 1.00
Above avg, each game had LeBron plus 1 or 2 other guys; though in G 4 and 5, it was Andersen for 10 min. and Lewis for 9.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 1:04 am
by xkonk
FWIW, the Heat were 20-10 with about a +4 point per game differential against the West in the regular season. They earned at least a split with every WC team they played. They obviously did better against the East in general (about +5), but it doesn't seem like a huge drop in performance.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 1:10 am
by HoopDon
Honestly, it seemed like the biggest factor in the Spurs' lopsided victory was Heat fatigue. The BIg-3 have racked up a gargantuan amount of minutes since 2011 (far more then the Spurs) and it showed.

Wade (allegedly) wasn't hurt, he just had nothing left. LeBron seemed to frequently start games out strong (offensively), only to fade away as the game progressed. His defense wasn't there all season, and after watching him in the Spurs series, it just didn't seem like he was physically capable of playing great D for more then 10 minutes a game. Birdman of course was injured, and Chalmers inexplicably fell off a cliff.

That said, a healthy/rested Heat team would likely still lose to the Spurs, it just wouldn't be the all-time drubbing we saw this year.

http://hoopdon.weebly.com/

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 1:56 am
by mystic
Mike G wrote:So, the Heat coach didn't use his best players or optimize their minutes? Or what?
Where did I say that at all? I simply stated that using regular season SRS of a team might give you not the best estimate for their playoff performance level. Using a reliable player metric and the minute distribution will outperform RS SRS significantly in terms of prediction.
Mike G wrote: If you're going to say the Miami competition wasn't very good, how about quantifying that? Of course, that was already done earlier in this thread.
No, I'm saying that runs could happen in a small sample. That does not mean that we have something we can rely on for predictions.

The numbers I get for the respective minute distribution:

Vs. CHA +10.9 expected, +9.8 result -> -1.1
Vs. BKN +6.9 expected, +5.4 result -> -1.5
Vs. IND +4.1 expected, +6.5 result - +2.4

Well, and the Pacers result outperformed the expectation only based on the blowout in game 6. Other than that the Heat played pretty much as expected in average during the EC playoffs. I haven't seen them "on a roll" at all, but I also took the expected performance level of the opponents into account (based on my metric and the minute distribution) when evaluating the Heat results. I went 13-7 against Vegas in Heat games overall, 9-6 in the EC playoffs ...
Mike G wrote: If SRS says SA was better by 4 ppg in the season, and 5 ppg in the playoffs -- and you say it's really 6 ppg -- what then accounts for the 14 ppg differential that resulted?
As I pointed out, 5 of those remaining 8 were based on lucky shooting by Leonard and Mills, then we have 2.4 left (accounting for HCA as well) for whatever reason. I wouldn't bet on +14, if the series gets replayed, rather based on +6 on neutral court.
Mike G wrote: The matchups were essentially the same this year and last year.
Really? Well, the Spurs played better over the course of the season than last season, having a better Ginobili, Parker and Diaw may have helped with that. The Heat played worse than last season. Therefore the whole matchup situation changed considerably, especially when we compare the offense by the Spurs vs. the defense by the Heat in this season with last years.
Mike G wrote:
In midseason, the Spurs had a 1-4 spell. Good thing they didn't blow up the team!
Uh? Who is saying that the Heat should blow that up simply based on those 5 games? I most certainly not. Again, because you might have missed it: The Heat have only 1 player fixed for next season: Norris Cole. The Heat may need to rebuild, even if they actually don't want to, because they have basically no quality players left on their roster ... Then we have the fact that Battier already stated he will retire, Ray Allen thinking about that as well ... a bunch of other players including Lewis, Andersen, Jones and Haslem will be 34+ when the next season starts. Wade, while still being capable of being a good player, will likely not be back to his former performance level and may not be able to play the minutes needed, James also looked like he had trouble with extended minutes, Bosh too. That all does not mean that the Heat can't build a winning team around James, Bosh and Wade anymore, just that they need considerably better players around them than they had in past seasons. To illustrate the point a bit, the net per 100 poss with James+Wade+Bosh for the past RS seasons:

2011: +15.4
2012: +12.5
2013: +12.6
2014: +7.0

That +7 is not enough for a championship contender, even though given the status of the EC, it can still be enough to make the finals.

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 10:46 am
by Dr Positivity
Very interesting summer for the Heat. My initial thought is they're going to sign a Pau or Gortat to beef up the starting lineup and go back to big ball. But I wonder if the better move is to go for depth and smaller contracts. Grabbing a handful of Josh McRoberts and Thabo level contracts may be a route to look at. I also think they should use a 2017 1st round pick to dump Haslem's 4.6 mil contract to Phllly or Utah or whatever. Although they desperately need young talent with how limited their window is I think the capspace does more for them

I have a hard time seeing the Heat beat the Spurs next year but they're still a contender based on being by far the East favorite. If they played a team like the Clips or Blazers in the Finals next year experience may play in their favor like in 2012, or Scott Brooks/Perkins may play in their favor if they go against OKC. They have to get in and hope for the best even though I strongly feel the Spurs are repeating next year

Re: 2014 Finals -- Heat vs Spurs

Posted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 11:18 am
by Mike G
mystic wrote: The numbers I get for the respective minute distribution:

Vs. CHA +10.9 expected, +9.8 result -> -1.1
Vs. BKN +6.9 expected, +5.4 result -> -1.5
Vs. IND +4.1 expected, +6.5 result - +2.4

Well, and the Pacers result outperformed the expectation only based on the blowout in game 6..
This is interesting. And while you can't predict the given series based on the to-be-played minutes, you get a different value for the ensuing series.

The SRS differential for Mia-Cha is about 5 ppg. You give Mia another expected 6 ppg, based on ... ?
- Jefferson averaging 8 fewer mpg, picked up by McRoberts? Everyone else within 3 mpg of RS for Cha
- Wade was full-time, Ray played less, Battier not at all; Haslem and Jones played more than usual.